muckefuck: (Default)
muckefuck ([personal profile] muckefuck) wrote2005-10-07 04:41 pm

Oys mainem moyl in dayn or

For those who were as afflicted with curiosity as me, I finally tracked down an etymology of kugl. It claims that the name of the dish derives from that of the pan in which it was baked; an explicit comparison was made with Gugelhupf (designating either a kind of ring-shaped cake pan or a cake baked in one). Who am I to disagree?

I've almost finished Mann's Das Gesetz. Despite some biblical language, the vocabulary's been pretty straightforward, necessitating only the occasional trip to the dictionary. Hit a doozy yesterday, though: heischten keifend! Apparently, it means they begged Moses for something in a nagging manner. The syntax isn't bad either (especially given that it's Mann), though there is the occasional Schachtelsazt. That's a new word I learned from Nuphy last night for those sentences that are so packed with clauses and phrases that you lose the thread before you ever get to the main verb and then have to go back and sort of reassemble the whole thing segment by segment.

One of these days, I'll write a bit about the wonderful words I'm finding in my forays into Weinrich's Yiddish dictionary. For instance, I recently found that the general word for "mouth" is moyl. This is interesting because the usual German word is Mund, but the cognate seems to have fallen out of use in Yiddish. Maul, the cognate to moyl, is normally used of animals and rude when applied to humans. Yiddish, however, has its own rude term for "mouth", which is pisk and is derived in turn from a vuglar Slavic word (cf. Ukrainian pysok "gob; [animal] mouth"). There, encapsulated in the language, you have a pre-modern Eastern European hierarchy of mouths!

[identity profile] danbearnyc.livejournal.com 2005-10-07 10:22 pm (UTC)(link)
So is moyl the same root as mohel? In ultra-Orthodox practice mohels bite off the foreskin (or part of the foreskin, anyway). There is an interesting case working its way through NYS courts involving a mohel who used this method and gave more than one young boy some form of Hepatitis.

[identity profile] muckefuck.livejournal.com 2005-10-07 10:37 pm (UTC)(link)
Nope, completely different sources. Mohel is from Hebrew (it's an agent noun but I couldn't tell you offhand what the verb stem is) whereas moyl and Maul both go back to Middle High German mul(e).

I heard about that case, but I didn't think it was that they bit the foreskin but that they sucked away the blood orally. I trust you to be intimate with the details, however.

[identity profile] danbearnyc.livejournal.com 2005-10-07 10:42 pm (UTC)(link)
No. One doesn't do bloodsports. No.

[identity profile] tyrannio.livejournal.com 2005-10-08 05:07 pm (UTC)(link)
My small Bantam-Megiddo gives "dilute, adulterate" for mem hay lamed.

[identity profile] keyne.livejournal.com 2005-10-08 03:51 pm (UTC)(link)
Herpes, actually, not hepatitis. At least one baby died.

[identity profile] danbearnyc.livejournal.com 2005-10-08 04:49 pm (UTC)(link)
Ah, eew, yes. I have hepatitis on the brain (not the liver) just now.

das Gesetz ...

[identity profile] nibadi.livejournal.com 2005-10-08 11:37 am (UTC)(link)
ich habe den Titel nie gehört und dachte mir, es ist vieleicht eine der Erzählungen aus *Joseph und seine Brüder*. Ich habe bei *amazon* nachgeschaut und es ist, wie ich vermutete.

War es gut?
Hast du eigentlich je etwas von Klaus Mann gelesen?

Diese Schachtelsätze, bei Thomas Mann bis heute bewundert, sind ansonsten heute heute sehr verpönt. Deutschlehrer korrigieren wie wild und machen aus einem Schachtelsatz 3 bis 5 neue Sätze.

Du hättest bestimmt deinen Spass an dem Buch von Bastian Sick: Der Dativ ist dem Genitiv sein Tod (Untertitel: Ein Wegweiser durch den Irrgarten der deutschen Sprache). Ein Taschenbuch, bei KIWI erschienen. Ich hoffe, dass es in Eurer Bibliothek verfügbar ist.

Auf dem Cover heisst es:

Die deutsche Sprache kennt zwar nur vier Fälle, dafür aber über tausend Zweifelsfälle. Heißt es Pizzas oder Pizzen? Gewinkt oder Gewunken? Wann schreibt man Storys und wann Stories? Hat der Genitiv noch eine Chance - trotz des Dativs und dem Dativ zum Trotz?

[identity profile] snowy-owlet.livejournal.com 2005-10-10 03:15 pm (UTC)(link)
Whom do you recommend as a good translator of Mann?

[identity profile] muckefuck.livejournal.com 2005-10-10 04:55 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm afraid I couldn't recommend anyone. I've never read him in translation.